jddadj
Sense Offender
Posts: 4
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Post by jddadj on Apr 12, 2008 17:49:42 GMT -5
Well the principle of the plot is that nobody has feelings right? Well some stuff I'm about to ask may take the "exacting" a bit too far by taking it too seriously but im a serious fan and i think about some things too much
But some things I have often wondered is:
- How come whenever preston beefs somebody, they scream in pain? Of course pain is something you can feel physically so the prozium cant stop that but, one screams in pain because of the major dislike he/she has to pain and the discomfort it causes in the brain. But if they are emotionless they wouldn't care about being in pain. Does anyone have an answer to this?
- People have spouses (so I assume they marry) and have children. But if they are emotionless, why do they either choose partners or are assigned partners? And how do they go about having children? Because they have no feelings they cant get horny so they are unable to reproduce since reproducing involves feelings
- Sometimes people do give some facial expressions and vary the tone of their voice when speaking even though they are emotionless (visualise the way preston speaks when he disagrees with partridge about how the clerics themselves are killing people and waging war just before he shoots him)
- All the items such as the cars and the buildings do have some sense of design right? I know they do look boring but they do have some sense of design so how would not having emotions enable you to design anything? Does this make sense or am I being too exacting?
- People have different hair cuts. How can they decide what haircut to have and why they would bother doing their hair if they have no feeling about it
- A baby learns to speak with human affection. So how would they learn how to speak in Libria?
- If people dont have emotion, why do they actually bother doing anything and value life? If they are emotionless, why do they feel the need to work or do anythin because they do not feel scared of death or consequence(i dunno maybe this is a stupid question) but preston seems to be really loyal to the state but for what purpose if he has no emotional value of it?
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Post by Aedh on Apr 12, 2008 20:16:20 GMT -5
First things first ... welcome to the boards, jddadj!! These questions have often been asked and discussed in the last five years. Threads that deal directly with various questions that you have would be the ones entitled "Feeling," "...sex?" and "Are all Clerics sense-offenders?" (All found on this board if you scroll thru a bit.) There are others, too. To provide a brief introduction ... the world of the film is open-ended. We're not like the fans of some films where things can get really geeky. No one will argue with you about where buttons go on uniforms or what kind of doorknob Dupont's office bathroom has. You are free to formulate your own theories and no one will flame you, at least probably not. I think. However there are a few points that have won a sort of consensus. One is that Prozium doesn't eliminate all emotion ... it simply tones down the "dizzying highs and abysmal lows." You still have senses. You're just not allowed to indulge them for your own enjoyment. However, putting them, in a moderated form, to the service of the State, seems to be encouraged. Why else would Clerics be groomed to inspire dread? Why the black coats ... why not just blue jeans, sneakers, and comfy jackets? Why the Cleric Cadillacs instead of more efficient scooters? Why the greyness built-in to the environment instead of the motley riot of randomness? Why should Father invoke long-lost history to condemn war and disaster? Why show Hitler and Stalin and Saddam Hussein if those images stirred no feelings? And ultimately, why would anyone care if anyone else showed emotion or not? If Prozium really eliminated ALL feeling, then sense-offence wouldn't be a crime. The very concept of it would be unintelligible. My own "take" is, to put it in a rather oversimplified fashion, that lack of emotion is not what the Prozium regime is all about ... but rather fear of emotion ... dread that untrammelled indulgence in feelings may lead to autonomous individualism, then in turn to destructive personal competition, finally resulting in disaster to society and the State. In short, good Librians, I think, believe that "we are all Hobbesians now." I cannot recommend too strongly that you spend some time reading the threads I mentioned, and there are many other good ones. Again welcome, and enjoy your visits. (Just don't let Father catch you enjoying them TOO much ... she can be a firecracker!!)  |
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Post by Mirabilis on Apr 12, 2008 21:04:09 GMT -5
What Aedh said! ;D Oh...and welcome indeed...by all means enjoy yourself...just don't forget to adjust your dose...  ...or else...  !!! |
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Post by aikidoal on Apr 14, 2008 12:40:05 GMT -5
I think screaming/loud exhale/wince is more or less an automatic response to pain, and it's also a reaction to suprise. I can see a Librian making a squawk which translated would be: "That shoulder lock which was correctly applied suddenly caused a pain in my scapula that I quite wasn't expecting."
It's up to you to decide how much Prozium would be required to put one's hand on a gas range without flinching. Personally, I think the dosage levels would cover most of the mediocre things such as papercuts.
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Post by Aedh on Apr 14, 2008 13:16:58 GMT -5
I was told as a nipper back in science class ... mind you, this was long enough ago so that when I brought a 12-gauge shotgun to school for show and tell, and threw in some lessons on gun safety for the benefit of the class, I was not only not arrested, but given a gold star for it ... that one reason we scream or grunt when hit/wounded/beefed is a reflex, meant by nature to give the lungs a chance to suck in a good rush of oxygen to prepare the body for action.
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jddadj
Sense Offender
Posts: 4
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Post by jddadj on Apr 21, 2008 17:45:48 GMT -5
wow thanks all for ur comments. especially aedh
anyway i watched equilibrium recently and noticed that the guys who got totally owned by john said f*** and s***!
I wouldve thought that as people don't feel a sense of anger or fear, they wudnt really swear. Cos swearing is usually a bad verbal expression.
and yes i have been dosing. I always have a dose at lunchtime. And when im working i function like a robot; I'm everybody's b**** and yet i dont object...i just obey.
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btw about me watching equilibrium recently: i have a 40inch TV and i must say the film was slightly disappointing on a screen that size cos the colour looks all dodgy...everyone's black coat is like dark blue and purple swirly dots as if it has a bad reception or something (which cant be possible cos its a DVD played in a player that upscales it). perhaps i shud get the movie on blu ray when it comes out. Do you think they will have improved the colour on blu ray? cos the PSP version is better than the DVD for quality of picture
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masha
Resistance Member
Posts: 26
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Post by masha on Jan 3, 2009 22:18:50 GMT -5
I'm new here so forgive me if I'm violating a rule, but-
There's a book by Dean Koontz called Midnight, where a guy comes up with a way to make people virtually indestractible through nano-technology, and that process makes them lose emotions because they are bad for health. However, some emotions/feelings necessary for survival are kept, such as fear, self-preservation, hunger, and sex drive. That seems to be a good way to also view what Prozium does.
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Post by Aedh on Jan 3, 2009 22:40:16 GMT -5
I'm new here so forgive me if I'm violating a rule, but- There's a book by Dean Koontz called Midnight, where a guy comes up with a way to make people virtually indestractible through nano-technology, and that process makes them lose emotions because they are bad for health. However, some emotions/feelings necessary for survival are kept, such as fear, self-preservation, hunger, and sex drive. That seems to be a good way to also view what Prozium does. Sounds interesting! I'll have to read it because I'm curious about how Mr K works it. Personally I have some doubts about being able to suppress some emotions while keeping others intact ... my understanding is that the emotional centres are all hard-wired together. In "Nonstop Murder & Lust," the approach I took is that in that society, people have decided to suppress their own emotions themselves. The NMAL approach is defective, of course, because people do an imperfect job of it; but that just creates interesting and suspenseful opportunities because you never know when someone's will will crack. Or when it will reassert itself. Basically in that world, emotion isn't illegal. It's just very, very ... un-cool. So you don't really need Clerics because every person has their own inner Cleric, so to speak. |
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masha
Resistance Member
Posts: 26
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Post by masha on Jan 31, 2009 14:49:27 GMT -5
I just saw the movie again a couple days ago, and in one of those brainwashing broadcasts it specifically said Prozium takes away the highs and the lows, implying some emotion will still remain.
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Post by Libby on Jan 31, 2009 18:56:34 GMT -5
I just saw the movie again a couple days ago, and in one of those brainwashing broadcasts it specifically said Prozium takes away the highs and the lows, implying some emotion will still remain. Kurt Wimmer was quite specific about this aspect of his film. He said I think Aedh nails it in his earlier comments... |
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masha
Resistance Member
Posts: 26
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Post by masha on Feb 1, 2009 9:41:18 GMT -5
I think I saw that comment by Wimmer before. But sometimes what the director intends and what comes across in the film are not the same. This however IS specifically addressed in the film, just not easy to notice on first viewing. That's why I bought the DVD, to watch it a few times and see what I might have missed:)
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