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Post by askew on Nov 15, 2003 15:29:51 GMT -5
I've fired .357 magnum which was a larf, and I agree there's no way you could fire it one handed or fully auto. I think it's a very minor glitch in the film. If the rounds was smaller than 9mm then why is the mussle flash bloody huge and the sound so basey? You would need like crappy .22 pistols to do all the gun Kata, but it wouldn't kill people like the cleric's guns. Maybe he's just shooting in the right places - Preston is after all a gun-kata master person
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Post by TrustKill on Dec 18, 2003 15:00:17 GMT -5
the cleric's weapons cannot be any larger than .40. beretta frames cannot hold anything larger. due to the ammo count (although i know this gets modified for films) i would say its nothing other than 9mm rounds. approximately 15 or 16 rounds are fired from a weapon before it s reloaded. .40 cal beretta 96s cant hold that many rounds. -the guns, under close inspection are simple 92F with a lot of custom work done. the whole slide/front portion of the muzzle are custom pieces. -as for the fire selection switch placement... this modification is impossible. it looks like the selector switch from the m-16 family or an MAC-11. the take down lever is located slightly forward of the selectors location on the pistol, and though i know it would take considerable time to take down the pistol anyway due to the front extended barrel and counter weights, the take down lever is a neccesity in holding the beretta pistol together as it holds the slide guide rod in place which is attached to the slide return spring, etc etc. besides that point, even automatic berettas (93R) have more than just a simple sear change to make them automatic. they require an entire mechanism to make them fire that rapidly. take a look at a handle profile of a 93R vs a 92 and you will see a huge difference. the right side of the handle has been significantly enlarged to encompass the mass of gears that are required for the mechanism to re-prime the trigger/hammer/firing pin. there is no way to squeeze all that intricacy into the frame of the pistol underneath the chamber without it getting in the way of the more neccessary requirements of the pistol... like the barrel. -it seems the closest way to recreate a cleric pistol would be to use a Beretta 93R, and good luck getting one of those to modify in the first place. -TrustKill-
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Post by TrustKill on Dec 18, 2003 15:06:54 GMT -5
oh... and to the guy talking about the 9mm style tank shells, the twin splitting pieces are called Sabots. they get used on a lot of different ammo types but especially on flechette rounds, which were little solid rounds that looked like throwing darts. nasty little things... you can still get them to load into shotgun shells but i digress. -sabot rounds arent any smaller than normal ones, they simply hold the projectile in place for accuracy. yes, they make them fire at a higher velocity, but they dont increase ammo capacity by much if at all.
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Post by SoulEscape on Dec 19, 2003 9:12:10 GMT -5
They probably just bought some blank firing beretta's and modified them. I personally own 2 of these. One of which I have modified a little. The guns fire 8mm blanks (although I think they have some that shoot 9mm blanks now) and hold 15 rounds (16 with one chambered). Since they don't actually fire real bullet tips, there isn't any recoil. (well slightly). And I'm doubting that they ever used any kind of full-auto in the movie (with the exception of the SMG's like the G-36, etc...). It's much easier, and cheaper, to fake it with a sound and or edit in muzzle flash. As far as the shaped muzzle flash goes, I'm 90% sure they probably did that with Adobe After Effects or something of the liking. It would be the easiest way to do it since you would just have to edit a few of the frames. Take a look at the movie "The Transporter". It has some neat effects as well. Mostly cool tracer effects. And why are you talking about the beefy sound they make? You know that was edited in, right? Almost all movies do that. Why? Well because normal gun sounds are boring. A movie that comes to mind where they didn't edit all the gun fire, is the movie HEAT. Those big shoot-out scenes in the street don't sound edited. Being a sound artist myself, I've already re-created the sound effect used in the movie. Cheers- -SoulEscape soulescape@havenofrags.com
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Post by ClericArucard on Dec 19, 2003 10:05:54 GMT -5
i looked into it, and did some searching theres a few gunsmiths(yes gunsmiths) in japan who say they canb duplicate the gun exactly, so when i save up enough resources i'm going to have it done(i can because i do not live in the USA so it will pas through Customs here) so we'll see. I'm a avid gun lover myself though i do not know as much detail in weaponry as i would like, i own one isralle Desert Eagle Black and Gold. .50, I own one B.A.R from WW2 one Masuer K-98k one Thompsn fully working just can't find APC bullets for it and one STG-44 i've spent quite the amount of money obtainning these weapons and they are all deadly as they are beautiful
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Post by TrustKill on Dec 19, 2003 10:25:18 GMT -5
not a bad collection. not bad at all.
-unfortunately, most of the weapons i know about are unavailable to me, or most anyone who is a civilian for that matter... it sounds like you are a big WWII weapons enthusiast. -among my personal favorites are: the steyr tmp, aug, hk mp7, fn f2000, five-seven and stuff like that. -TrustKill-
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Post by the Dude on Jan 7, 2004 23:44:01 GMT -5
In response to the question of the caliber of the gun it would be more likely that a little known and very much superior bullet the 5.7 it is used in a military rifle known as the P90 anything larger than 9mm would have too much kick to be anywhere in the realm of effective in a handgun firing full auto and if I were to aquire one of them i would hope thats what it fires
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Post by Eihtball on Jan 25, 2004 12:37:34 GMT -5
They probably just bought some blank firing beretta's and modified them. I personally own 2 of these. One of which I have modified a little. The guns fire 8mm blanks (although I think they have some that shoot 9mm blanks now) and hold 15 rounds (16 with one chambered). Since they don't actually fire real bullet tips, there isn't any recoil. (well slightly). The guns in the movie were genuine Berettas. Those cheap blank-firing Berettas don't have trademarks on the gun (among other features). The guns in EQ did. I'm certain that those were real Berettas modified with extra props for the movie. As far as the shaped muzzle flash goes, I'm 90% sure they probably did that with Adobe After Effects or something of the liking. It would be the easiest way to do it since you would just have to edit a few of the frames. Take a look at the movie "The Transporter". It has some neat effects as well. Mostly cool tracer effects. Not really. In my experience, real guns firing blanks is still standard practice in the film industry. Using post-production CG editing is not as realistic as many people seem to think it is. For one thing, it's difficult to simulate working actions and recoil with fake guns (such as airsoft), and usually, when muzzle flashes get added later, the lighting is off on the actors. Most propmasters and armorers who are in charge of guns on-set will tell you that they would never use anything except real weapons and blanks for scenes when guns are fired or seen close-up. And this is coming from a person who's been on the sets of various low-budget pictures, music videos, and TV shows (including Court TV). I can tell you guys about such experiences if you so desire.
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JonF
Resistance Member
Posts: 61
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Post by JonF on Jan 25, 2004 13:15:12 GMT -5
In the case of EQ, the muzzle flashes from the modded Berettas were most definitely CGI. We have this on authority from the commentary, and also because no gun in the world could produce a 'tetra' flash consisting of four T-shaped plumes! In some shots, however, 'gas-pipe' guns were used and their original flash left intact, as were the flashes from some of the real guns used.
As an aside about the 5.7mm cartridge mentioned above, why would they redesign the entire 9mm Beretta 92 to fire this exotic cartridge, when 9mm blanks have perfectly controllable recoil?
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Post by Eihtball on Jan 25, 2004 14:45:55 GMT -5
In the case of EQ, the muzzle flashes from the modded Berettas were most definitely CGI. We have this on authority from the commentary, and also because no gun in the world could produce a 'tetra' flash consisting of four T-shaped plumes! In some shots, however, 'gas-pipe' guns were used and their original flash left intact, as were the flashes from some of the real guns used. Oh, I know you're right about that. I'm dispelling the rumor, however, that CGI is used EXCLUSIVELY when guns are fired in movies (as in, they just take non-firing or airsoft guns and add the gunfire later). I'm sure that Tetra-shaped muzzle flashes were done with CGI. However, throughout the movie, you can clearly see the slides moving and the muzzle flashes casting flickers that would not be possible with CGI.
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Post by Eihtball on Jan 25, 2004 14:47:01 GMT -5
In other words, what I'm saying is that they fired blanks on-set, and then added the Tetra-shaped flashes later in post-production as a small easter egg.
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